x Semponium

[Paul S]

These purported hybrids have been around for a while now, being launched with a huge fanfare and hyperbole. Not to mention extortionate price tag - £60 a pop initially :shock: It is said that the boys at Surreal Succulents had somehow achieved the theoretically impossible hybrid - Sempervivum x Aeonium. Pitched as combining the hardiness of Sempervivum with the size and flamboyance of an Aeonium no wonder they soon became best sellers. Sempervivum is stated to be the seed parent - ie plants would have been raised from seed harvested from the Sempervivum parent - this bit is the important bit.

Neil was given a range of plants by Danny, who has the nursery outlet within the grounds of Tremenheere - mostly plants that didn't quite make it to being named cultivars. I had a few offsets from Neil. In my experience and that of my circler of friends growing these, far from being robust, hardy aeonium-a-likes, they are fickle and hard-to-please plants that keep their Sempervivum heritage quiet, looking and behaving exactly like Aeonium hybrids and melting at the first sign of frost.

Yesterday I received my copy of the Sedum Society newsletter and an interrnationally acclaimed expert in Crassulacea, Margrit Bischofberger, 'reviewed' a plant of x Semponium 'Destiny' she had bought the previous year, closely examining the morpholgy and behaviour of the plant and, in particular, structure and timing of the flowers. She says a lot in the article, mostly over my head, but ends with this sentence.

In short: there is no trace of Sempervivum discernable in this plant.

Make of this what you will.

Edit - removed a bit.

[Andrew in Germany]

…Sounds a bit like a scam…

[JohnH]

That is very interesting, Paul. At the very least, the sellers appear to have significantly over promised and under delivered, I am afraid.

I have tried quite a few of the different named varieties at great expense, all have perished outdoors at the slightest hint of frost and, weirdly, long before many of my Aeonium.

Keeping them bone dry in a cold frame was the only way they would tolerate any cold and I could get them through winter. They would look awful by spring and take a long time to recover although they were perhaps a little more inclined to grow in the heat of summer than my regular Aeonium, but I did water and feed them very generously. I have given up now.

I have long wondered how they would appear in flower, and it is interesting to hear plants have eventually reached flowering size. Are there any pictures?

[Paul S]

…Sounds a bit like a scam…

It does, rather, doesn't it.

John, there was a poor picture of the inflorescence and a close up of a flower - the author said they were just exactly like an aeonium flower, produced exactly when you would expect an aeonium to flower in winter.

Had the seed parent been aeonium, there would possibly be a little bit of wiggle room for a mistake in pollination, maybe self-set. That the seed parent is stated to be sempervivum eliminates this - there would surely be sempervivum traits visible. So if it is true and if you eliminate this happening by chance there is only one conclusion.

[Chad]

To be fair this is a comment on only one cultivar.

The RHS were highly sceptical when first approached about the intergeneric hybrid until they had a plant to examine and then they were happy.

Flowers on another cultivar don't look like 'pure' Aeonium to me, but I'm not a botanist.

Were all the hybrids reputed to be with the Sempervivum as the seed parent?

Chad

[Paul S]

To be fair this is a comment on only one cultivar.

The RHS were highly sceptical when first approached about the intergeneric hybrid until they had a plant to examine and then they were happy.

Flowers on another cultivar don't look like 'pure' Aeonium to me, but I'm not a botanist.

Were all the hybrids reputed to be with the Sempervivum as the seed parent?

Chad

Only the one that has been examined by an expert and published in a peer reviewed journal? Yes, as far as I know, Chad. Are you suggesting that's Ok then?

[Chad]

Are you suggesting that's Ok then?

Thanks for pointing out my naïvety Paul.

I was considering this in horticultural not moral terms.

Chad

[Paul S]

Chad, it's not about naïvety or morality - the criminal implications of this are massive. How many plants have been sold? How much money has been made? People go to prison for a lot less. A lot of 'ifs', though.

[MartinNicklin]

A friend of mine bought from them these plants. I’ve been a customer when I went through my Aeonium phase. I’m no botanist so don’t understand the science behind it all but given the cloud around this, ought they to still be selling them until it’s cleared up? I notice they’ve brought a new one out this year.

[JohnH]

This does all sound rather 'iffy'. If the x semponium are proved not to be as we expected, are we to imagine they just inadvertently/accidentally picked straight Aeonium seedlings that had found themselves in a batch of the original 'cross' to raise and market?
As Paul says, the whole point of their strategy was to push the seed parent as Sempervivum and market the plants as such.

I seem to remember receiving a news letter from this particular nursery stating the two owners had parted company last year, albeit amicably.

I guess I am happy failures on this occasion were not entirely due to my usual incompetence :roll: